this is the best source i have been able to find on this issue. the information presented here is rigorously scientific, the format is user friendly and the writing is readable and understandable.

they also have a forum dedicated to exactly this issue. i reccomend those on every side of the debate take a look.

TalkOrigins Archive: Exploring the Creation/Evolution Controversy

I've been a fan of TO and the PT fo years. What is really cool is, these are actually working, noted scientists who produce articles, research papers and books....and they will actually answer your questions!

"Well, I think 2 + 2 = 5! Those arrogant mathematicians are trying to squelch the opposing view! Why don't we teach the kids that 2 + 2 = 4 OR 2 + 2 = 5 and let them decide for themselves? They should hear BOTH theories!"

I think the whole "ATP" thing and cellular respiration is made up. We get our energy from tiny, invisible elves that float all around and are in everything. You can't feel them and there's no evidence to suggest it, but you can't DISPROVE them, so that means it must be true by default.

We should teach our kids both Cellular Respiration AND Elven Energizing and let them choose which one they think is right!

It amazes me to see what great lengths "concerned parents" will go to. They've already taught their own kids all about their Creationist hogwash: now they need to make sure all the other kids hear it, too! It's a poorly disguised attempt to turn school into church. These are the same people who got angry when the Ten Commandments got taken out and mandatory prayer was removed. This is their attempt at revenge. Judging from the decline of our educational system, I think kids should be spending a little less time praying and a little more time studying, or actually paying attention in class. The religion can wait until Sunday.

Well if you really want to press it, 2+2 can equal 5.

2.4 + 2.4 = 4.8

When rounding 2.4 = 2 and 4.8 = 5


Wikimedia Error

Significant digits

In measurement in physics, the number of significant digits is usually encoded in the way a number is written. That is, unless otherwise specified, "2" has only one significant digit, which means it represents a measurement with a margin of error of 0.5, which means the actual value may lie between 1.5 and 2.5. When adding such measurements together, the margins of error are also added, so 2 ± 0.5 + 2 ± 0.5 = 4 ± 1.0 . And since "5" actually means 5 ± 0.5, these margins clearly overlap and one could jokingly argue that the numbers are the same. A popular phrasing of this statement is "2 + 2 = 5 for large values of 2 or small values of 5". When adding more precise measurements, for example 2.0 + 2.0, the margin of error is smaller and the maximum number that could be "reached" would in this case be 4.1. See also approximation and floating point.

I never argued that 2 + 2 doesn't equal 5. Did you say that? I said that it's a perfectly legitimate second option and should be taught alongside, just like Elven Energizing and Intelligent Design.

The problem is that Intelligent Design has no empirical support. 2+2=5 does, under specific mathematical rules and is not really a perfectly legitimate second option its an exception.

I understand the technicality. But generally speaking, 2 + 2 does not equal 5. You know I was using it as a quick example of an incorrect statement being presented as fact. However, your point that 2 + 2 can legitimately equal 5 (whereas, doubtlessly, Creationism can never be true) does serve a just cause.

How about this: let's teach our kids that America is a Christian nation, founded upon Judaeo-Christian values! The ten amendments in the Bill of Rights are reflected by the Ten Commandments (after all, they could have picked any number, right?) We'll also teach them that there is a huge liberal conspiracy and that global warming is made up.

...Oh, wait. We ARE teaching that. Ha, ha! Wait, that's not funny.

Ten Commandments. Ten fingers and ten toes. That must be why there weren't Twelve Commandments.

There were Fifteen, but Moses dropped one of those Stone Tablets.

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"Moreover, I am cognizant of the interrelatedness of all communities and states...Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality, tied in a single garment of destiny. Whatever affects one directly, affects all indirectly. Never again can we afford to live with the narrow, provincial "outside agitator" idea. Anyone who lives inside the United States can never be considered an outsider anywhere within its bounds."



~Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Tsk, tsk! Well someone should have helped him, I bet they were damn heavy.