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Political Parties and Ideologies Discuss all political parties and Ideologies here. Everyone is welcome to share their political beliefs here.

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by leviathon435 View Post
So what you want is a democracy of the "informed"?
Could that be an argument for elitism? Only the informed can vote. Interesting. Then the term "democracy" can be replaced with "oligarchy".
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 05:42 PM
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Could that be an argument for elitism? Only the informed can vote. Interesting. Then the term "democracy" can be replaced with "oligarchy".
Was the end point of my argument so obvious?
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by leviathon435 View Post
So what you want is a democracy of the "informed"?
Well first off I said I would not force either way, freedom being most important.
But, I would advise people to get informed because if you vote in ignorance you are doing nothing but harm.
It is not hard to become informed.

Last edited by xjoe3x : 04-15-2008 at 05:52 PM.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by diuretic View Post
People here are usually given a nominal fine if they don't vote. However if someone makes an issue of it they can be imprisoned. This is the only case I'm aware of but it ws for a breach of an injunction rather than being directly related to the issue of voting.

Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission Website
Thanks for the info.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 05:52 PM
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Could that be an argument for elitism? Only the informed can vote. Interesting. Then the term "democracy" can be replaced with "oligarchy".
That is not what I said or implied though.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by xjoe3x View Post
Well first off I said I would not force either way, freedom being most important.
But, I would advise people to get informed because if you vote in ignorance you are doing nothing but harm.
Yes, but again why does forcing people to vote go against any of this? If you feel uninformed you are still able to spoil a ballot paper.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 05:56 PM
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Yes, but again why does forcing people to vote go against any of this? If you feel uninformed you are still able to spoil a ballot paper.
Well of course there is the "forcing" part.
That makes uninformed people have to vote, which does nothing but harm, instead of letting them choose. Decreasing the amount of ignorant voters.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by xjoe3x View Post
Well of course there is the "forcing" part.
That makes uninformed people have to vote, which does nothing but harm, instead of letting them choose. Decreasing the amount of ignorant voters.
the "force" means little, it takes what? 15minutes? Not a huge amount of time, and it's a citizens duty like reporting crime. Again your uninformed argument rests on the premise that "informed" people are the only ones who should vote, whether or not the others are free to do so. Would it not be better just to teach people about politics from a younger age, get them interested and make them informed.
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Trust me, I'm a socialist!

There's power in a factory,power in the land, power in the hand of the worker. But it all amounts to nothing if together we don't stand, there is power in a union.
The union forever defending our rights, down with the blackleg, workers unite. To our brothers and our sisters in many far off lands, there is power in a union.
Money speaks for money, the devil for his own. - Billy Bragg
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by leviathon435 View Post
the "force" means little, it takes what? 15minutes? Not a huge amount of time, and it's a citizens duty like reporting crime. Again your uninformed argument rests on the premise that "informed" people are the only ones who should vote, whether or not the others are free to do so. Would it not be better just to teach people about politics from a younger age, get them interested and make them informed.
That does not matter. It is still taking away freedom and making someone do something against there will. It is not a citezens duty to vote, it is there freedom to do so. Forcing them is not only wrong in that sense but it does not achieve any good, just harm. If you vote while uniformed you are not helping you are hurting. Lets say 60% of voters are uninformed and 75% of them vote for person A. Person B gets 75% of the informed vote, Person A gets 25%. Person A wins from ignorance, I can not see how that is a good thing. It is not hard to become informed on an election, at least in the US. At the minimum the major issues are all listed conveniently on one website. (onthe issues.org) Most importantly is preserving freedoms, so yes it would be important that uninformed are free to vote like everyone else. Although the argument to keep uninformed voters from voting is much stronger than forcing everyone to vote. I am taught math and many other things in school that does not make me interested in them.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2008, 06:26 PM
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Ok, here is my question:
How is having this law good?
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