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Other Issues Discuss other areas of moral and worldly importance that other forum areas do not cover.

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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donkey Jote View Post
They were both empires.

Empire pissing match. Nothing more.
I'll take your word for it, I don't know the history, but who started it is unimportant the war was an imperialist one for both sides.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Skerlnik View Post
I am gonna agree with Chan, here.
There's hope for you yet.

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I am by nature a non-interventionist (at least foreign policy-wise). We should trade equally (best price on oil, regardless of regime), and certainly provide aid when asked and our fair quota of UN troops.
Well, I don't know about trading equally but certainly trading freely. If China makes a better product than Uzbekistan, the United States should buy that product from China. As for foreign aid, I'm opposed to governments doing foreign aid. Leave it up to the private aid agencies, the corporations, and private citizens willing to send money or supplies or themselves.

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Non-intervention doesn't necessarily mean a complete withdrawal from the world. I think a policy of co-existence is far superior that continually demanding everyone dance to our tune. The debacles in Iraq and Afghanistan have only reinforced my view.
Agreed: non-interventionism is not isolationism.

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That said, our economic fates are rather interwined with the world's. It is in our best interest if we mellowed out and became trusted partners, rather than bullies. And, yes, sometimes that means doing things that are NOT in our immediate best interest, like abiding by the Kyoto Protocols, as a show of good faith that we are responsible members of the international community, not simply the biggest kid in the sandbox.
Well, I don't agree with you regarding Kyoto since the economic impact would be devastating especially for third world countries. Again, we should trade freely and let the marketplace do what it does.

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Rather than railing against the UN for eroding our sovereignty, I'd love for the UN to take the brunt of international peacekeeping. We've emasculated it by ignoring it when it was convenient, undermining the point of what it's suppsed to be. I say, if they want the job, they can certainly have it!
I'd like the US to pull out of the UN because it has become an entanglement. Since I don't believe in interfering in the internal affairs of other countries, there is no need for UN peacekeepers.

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All of a sudden, we'd have removed a huge source of animosity towards us in the Middle East. They'll never love us, true, but in time they might be able to calm down. It's no coincidence oil shot through the roof, when we decided to destroy Iraq.
So we pull out and let them do whatever they're going to do.

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There's nothing wrong with being the biggest/best nation. But, there's honor in being at least a "gracious winner". That's what I think of, hearing the term "Citizen Superpower".
We were the gracious winner at the end of World War II when we re-built Germany and Japan. But, since I don't believe in interfering in the internal affairs of other nations...
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by leviathon435 View Post
I disagree, a war started by another but continued unnecessarily by the previous defender still shows imperialism.
Wars should be continued until they end either in a winner or in a mutual agreement to end it. It could have been worse: we could have taken posession of Spain as well.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donkey Jote View Post
They were both empires.

Empire pissing match. Nothing more.
More like the young upstart (America) taking on the king of the hill (Spain).
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
Wars should be continued until they end either in a winner or in a mutual agreement to end it. It could have been worse: we could have taken posession of Spain as well.
That's presumably debateable, whether or not you had the power too, but regardless do you deny it was anything other than an imperialist venture?
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by leviathon435 View Post
I'll take your word for it, I don't know the history, but who started it is unimportant the war was an imperialist one for both sides.
Who started it is subject to debate. When I was in school we learned about how Spain started it but a little deeper digging suggests that the United States may have started it from behind the scenes.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chan View Post
More like the young upstart (America) taking on the king of the hill (Spain).
This is late 19th century, I think then you'll find that Britain was the king of the hill.
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There's power in a factory,power in the land, power in the hand of the worker. But it all amounts to nothing if together we don't stand, there is power in a union.
The union forever defending our rights, down with the blackleg, workers unite. To our brothers and our sisters in many far off lands, there is power in a union.
Money speaks for money, the devil for his own. - Billy Bragg
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:05 PM
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Can I suggest a thread on the Spanish American war?
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leviathon435 View Post
That's presumably debateable, whether or not you had the power too, but regardless do you deny it was anything other than an imperialist venture?
If Spain started it then it's imperialism (since Spain was an empire). If the U. S. started it then it wasn't imperialism (because the U. S. wasn't an empire).
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

Reply With Quote
  #40 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2008, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donkey Jote View Post
Can I suggest a thread on the Spanish American war?
Sorry Donkey.
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Trust me, I'm a socialist!

There's power in a factory,power in the land, power in the hand of the worker. But it all amounts to nothing if together we don't stand, there is power in a union.
The union forever defending our rights, down with the blackleg, workers unite. To our brothers and our sisters in many far off lands, there is power in a union.
Money speaks for money, the devil for his own. - Billy Bragg
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