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  #71 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2008, 06:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosco View Post
Was Himmler a prisoner of War or a war criminal?


We're not talking about Himmler, are we.
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  #72 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2008, 08:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donkey Jote View Post


We're not talking about Himmler, are we.
You asked me war criminals or prisoners of war.
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2008, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Bosco View Post
You asked me war criminals or prisoners of war.
We're talking about Cuba, not Nazi Germany.
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old 04-26-2008, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Comrade Joe View Post
Is this what im supposed to respond to Gman. There isn't exactly anything worth replying to, it's just vague nonsense. None the less Che wouldn't have "blown your brains out", unless you are an enemy combatant or terrorist, but it's irrelevant and off topic anyway.
Actually you're no more required to respond to my post than I was to your ridiculous comment.
It's actually hard to say how the maniac that was guvara would have reacted.
I suspect however that when provoked or challenged, the gun was his answer.
Then, he'd run out and give a speech about how his victims had oppressed the people moving him closer to saint hood.
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old 04-26-2008, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by gman View Post
Actually you're no more required to respond to my post than I was to your ridiculous comment.
It's actually hard to say how the maniac that was guvara would have reacted.
I suspect however that when provoked or challenged, the gun was his answer.
Then, he'd run out and give a speech about how his victims had oppressed the people moving him closer to saint hood.
I didn't know that Guevara was from Texas.
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Old 04-26-2008, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Donkey Jote View Post
I didn't know that Guevara was from Texas.
Doesn't matter where he was from. He is acclaimed to have been a doctor.
I don't know if the Hippocratic oath is just an American oath or one that is recognized world wide, but if it is accepted world wide, it seems that guvera was more "hypocrite". Something to do with "do no harm"...............
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Old 04-27-2008, 01:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gman View Post
Doesn't matter where he was from. He is acclaimed to have been a doctor.
I don't know if the Hippocratic oath is just an American oath or one that is recognized world wide, but if it is accepted world wide, it seems that guvera was more "hypocrite". Something to do with "do no harm"...............
Guevara was a medic, not a doctor, he wouldn't have needed to take the Hippocratic oath.
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Old 04-27-2008, 01:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Mestizo View Post
Guevara was a medic, not a doctor, he wouldn't have needed to take the Hippocratic oath.
Graduated from med school, served as a medic, but was, in fact, a doctor. Oh, and a murderer and prominent figure within a bankrupt political system that ignores human rights and makes the eyes of Allah glow red with anger.
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Old 05-04-2008, 11:47 AM
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Che was fighting against American Imperialism. That's one thing most Americans don't understand. To understand Che they have to get to the point to where they understand the true role of the US in Latin America and the rest of the third world.

Smedley Butler on Interventionism
Making The World Safe For Hypocrisy
Imperialism 101
THE AMERICAN EMPIRE AND THE U.S. SYSTEM OF CLIENT STATES
confessions of an economic hit man - Google VÃ*deo

Before the revolution Cuba had an American puppet government and the people Che killed were members of death squads and torturers who killed and tortured people who were active in opposition politics.

Enter "Death squads" and "Torture" in this search engine.
ht://Dig WWW Search

The CIA had trained a lot of those killers and torturers.
Uruguay 1964-1970 Killing Hope WBlum

I live in Madrid and I have talked to Cubans here. They are all anti-American imperialism. They don't all like what happened after the revolution succeeded in overthrowing it though. This is where it gets a little foggy and I still don't fully understand what happened.
Right after the success of the revolution almost everybody was happy because Cuba's resources would no longer be stolen by American companies. Even the owners of small businesses were happey. Then, the new government began to expropriate small businesses. Lot's people who supported Fidel at the beginning went to Miami along with those who were complicit in American imperialism including lots of people who actually fought with him.
I'm still not certain whether Fidel and Che and the few at the top were planning to do this all along, or if they had to do itas a condition to get much-needed help from the Russians. Lot's of Cubans see this as a betrayal of the revolution they'd supported.
There's propaganda on both sides of the story. The official US version ignores the fact that Cuba was a de facto American colony and only tells its citizens about the expropriation of businesses and the conversion to socialism.
Books like this one below do a good job of explaining American imperialism but don't explain the expropriation of small businesses.
Cuba For Beginners :: AK Press
Amazon.com: Cuba for Beginners: Eduardo Del Rio: Books

There is so much propaganda that the only way to figure out what's happening is to talk to Cubans who were there and lots of them don't give the big picture.
Most of the ones I've talked to agree that the situation was generally better for the average Cuban after the revolution although they think it could have been done with controlled capitalism that didn't permit the exploitation of Cubas resources by foreigners.

There's an interesting analysis of what was happening in the Dominican Republic in this article.
The Empire and Ourselves, by Noam Chomsky

The Dominicans managed to get control of their resources again and they wanted a capitalistic democracy. The US went in and took it back over anyway.

I'm foggy on why Cuba took the road it did after the success of the revolution. I don't know if they had to do it, or if they'd been planning it all along or if it was necessary to stop hunger and provide education to all the people fast.

If there is an open democracy with free elections, the CIA knows how to penetrate it and get anyone elected it wants to.

Trojan Horse: The National Endowment for Democracy

There's a guy named Edward Herman who writes about election manipulation.

Here is one of his articles.
The Afghan, El Salvador, and Iraq Elections U.S. managed elections, with the threat of violence, are called "democratic" by Edward S. Herman

More can be found in Google.

Of course the "Free elections" in the US are a total sham.
Bilderberg Club

The media ignore anyone who hasn't made a pact with the shadow government. Whoever is elected takes orders from the same group of people so there might as well have been just one person in power since the fifties. The "Elections" in the US are just a sham to give the appearance of democracy so they are not anyone to go preaching about free elections.

I still don't fully understand why Che and Fidel took the road they did after they'd won the war or whether it was necesary but there's no arguing with the fact that they saved Cuba from American imperialism.

When I think about that and listen to this song, I get the chills.
YouTube - Hasta Siempre

This is one of those situations where we have to realize that there is probably some new piece of information we haven't learned yet and we have to be ready to modify our opinions when we get this information. If I find out that people who non-violently opposed the revolution were executed and am able to verify that it's true, I'll modify my opinion of Che accordingly. No Cubans I've spoken to have told me that yet though. So far Che's been my hero.
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  #80 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2008, 12:41 PM
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Cosmored: to my understanding, Fidel Castro was never a communist. The Cuban Revolution became a communist revolution because of the influence of Ernesto Guevara, and, as you said, the Soviet Union.

One of my favourite guys from the revolution, Camilo Cienfuegos, was also not a communist. He died when his plane disappeared and is now a hero in Cuba. One does have to ask what the circumstances of that plane crash was though.
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