But lets be honest, the average guy on the street can't decide (not everyone has sufficient knowledge) and individually we have little impact, it takes a collective to make real significant change. The government can listen to scientists and plan accordingly.

__________________
Viva Fidel

If there ever was in the history of humanity an enemy who was truly universal, an enemy whose acts and moves trouble the entire world, threaten the entire world, attack the entire world in any way or another, that real and really universal enemy is precisely Yankee imperialism

They talk about the failure of socialism but where is the success of capitalism in Africa, Asia and Latin America?

While their is Capitalism their is competition, there is low costs and their are consumers. The food we eat comes from supermarkets come at a serious cost to the environment.

The princepals of capitalism are a key componant to this damage.

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"We will disobey your laws as long as they are unjust and they make a world shaped only for your profit"-G8 protestor Genoa 2001





NO PASERÁN!!

"We learned a long time ago that we should never subject ourselves to the schedules of the powerful. We had to follow our own calendar and impose it on those above.” - Subcommandante Marcos

Yes, the collective public shares their collective intellegence and their collective stupidity, so they really can't be given the full reigns. But the government also has the ability to minipulate the scientists, by giving blowhorns to those that agree with them and scilenceing those that disagree with them. Meaning that both the public and the government have different faults that makes each of them inadequate to be in complete control (that actually stems into my idea of a perfect government, but back on topic).

So partial power should be given to both the public and the government. Each one acting to check the other.

__________________
Set your destination with your heart, get there with your mind.

"The wisest men follow their own direction." - Euripides

Whether the supermarkets and farms are owned by individuals or the state makes no impact on how it damages the enviroment.

__________________
Set your destination with your heart, get there with your mind.

"The wisest men follow their own direction." - Euripides

Well the state may stop importing things all across the worldthat can be produced at home, thus saving countless waste of oil. The capitalists will never do this at the expense of profit.

__________________
Viva Fidel

If there ever was in the history of humanity an enemy who was truly universal, an enemy whose acts and moves trouble the entire world, threaten the entire world, attack the entire world in any way or another, that real and really universal enemy is precisely Yankee imperialism

They talk about the failure of socialism but where is the success of capitalism in Africa, Asia and Latin America?

I can get on board with that idea, which is probably closer to what Morales himself would like to see, given that he is no communist.

__________________
Viva Fidel

If there ever was in the history of humanity an enemy who was truly universal, an enemy whose acts and moves trouble the entire world, threaten the entire world, attack the entire world in any way or another, that real and really universal enemy is precisely Yankee imperialism

They talk about the failure of socialism but where is the success of capitalism in Africa, Asia and Latin America?

That will also hurt the economies of those nations that are producing that stuff for us. But that is not something to get into in this thread (I don't think).

__________________
Set your destination with your heart, get there with your mind.

"The wisest men follow their own direction." - Euripides

I disagree. If a supermarket was ran by a state then the small industries that manufacture and package the products for the supermarket would given a fair price. Thereby creating jobs in those industries and help stabilise the economy. Also Farmers would be given a fair price for their produce bujt could also be limited in their use of pesticides which harm the eco-system by piosening water supplies thereby poisening fish which affects that food chain. Also pesticides affect other food chains.

Capitalist ventures such as supermarkets create a lot of waste such as fruit, packaging on cucumbers. Importing goods from long distances thereby creating pollution through aeroplanes. The pressure put on farmers by supermarkets to mass produce leads to intensive farming thereby leading to the over use of fertiliser and pesticides. Capitalists care for nothing but the profit they make out of it all.

__________________
"We will disobey your laws as long as they are unjust and they make a world shaped only for your profit"-G8 protestor Genoa 2001





NO PASERÁN!!

"We learned a long time ago that we should never subject ourselves to the schedules of the powerful. We had to follow our own calendar and impose it on those above.” - Subcommandante Marcos

The majority of the people in these economies are not getting a fair proce for their produce anyway so the only real harm it will do is to the pokets of the corporatains.

__________________
"We will disobey your laws as long as they are unjust and they make a world shaped only for your profit"-G8 protestor Genoa 2001





NO PASERÁN!!

"We learned a long time ago that we should never subject ourselves to the schedules of the powerful. We had to follow our own calendar and impose it on those above.” - Subcommandante Marcos

The farmers would still have to use pesticides. Do you think because the farmers are making more money that the pesty insects and fungi would just leave?

The preasure to mass produce aren't caused by the supermarkets or capitalism, it is caused by the large population that needs to be feed. Unless you're talking about mass killings just to lower the population, than there is nothing that can be done to fully correct that.

In regards to the polution from airplanes, that is because many places aren't capible of growing their own food and so need to bring it from somewhere else. And many places are able to grow more food than they need, and so are able to ship it to those that need it. Once again, this isn't anything to do with capitalism, but the logistics and the enviroment.

__________________
Set your destination with your heart, get there with your mind.

"The wisest men follow their own direction." - Euripides