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Civil Liberties and Civil Rights Discuss Civil Liberties and Civil rights here. Also discuss discrimination against minority groups as well, and ways to solve these issues.

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 08-27-2008, 03:46 PM
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Default Evicted! One-horse town to be no-horse town

HICKMAN, Neb. - This one-horse town looks like it's set to become a no-horse town.

The owner of a 32-year-old horse named Peter Rabbit wasn't able to buck a local ban on livestock within city limits.

After widespread publicity of the ban that threatened to kick Peter Rabbit off the pasture where he was born, the Hickman City Council considered an ordinance Tuesday night that would allow horses inside city limits. But council members ultimately voted 4-2 against adopting it, leaving the ban intact.

One-horse town to be no-horse town - Animal weirdness - MSNBC.com

So, this guy has raised this horse on the same land where it was born more than 30 years ago and these damned politicians come along, annex is land to their town and then tell him he's got to get rid of the horse!

You damned government-loving nanny staters can shove your perverse hatred for liberty up your backsides!
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Old 08-27-2008, 03:57 PM
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So, this guy has raised this horse on the same land where it was born more than 30 years ago and these damned politicians come along, annex is land to their town and then tell him he's got to get rid of the horse!
Yep. Nothing makes him any more or less special than anyone else. Laws aren't individual-specific. But, I already know your position on how laws should be convenient to the individual.

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You damned government-loving nanny staters can shove your perverse hatred for liberty up your backsides!
If you're this upset over some idiot hick who wants special treatment to have a horse in a city, I can't imagine how you'd react about something of actual importance.....
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Old 08-27-2008, 04:03 PM
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Yep. Nothing makes him any more or less special than anyone else. Laws aren't individual-specific. But, I already know your position on how laws should be convenient to the individual.



If you're this upset over some idiot hick who wants special treatment to have a horse in a city, I can't imagine how you'd react about something of actual importance.....
The guy was there before the town was and the town annexed his property and I'm sure he wasn't given a choice over it. So, yes, his rights take priority.

I'm so damn sick and tired of piss-ant suburbanites moving out into the country and then demanding that the country folks change to suit them!
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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Old 08-27-2008, 04:44 PM
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The guy was there before the town was and the town annexed his property and I'm sure he wasn't given a choice over it. So, yes, his rights take priority.
Obviously not, and courts tend to agree with me.

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I'm so damn sick and tired of piss-ant suburbanites moving out into the country and then demanding that the country folks change to suit them!
Not a good situation, I agree. I have to deal with that all the time, at work. People that think that they live way out in the sticks fail to acknowledge that the city grows closer and closer...or think that just because they've been there for fifty years grants them some sort of status that grants them the right to be a nuisance. Yes, I deal with this argument every day.

What I take exception to is the idea of governance by individual exception. The desires of some lone hick to have a horse in the city simply shouldn't take precidence over the needs of a community to have consistent ordinances, sorry, unless, of course, the community wants to grant that. If you allow one dude to have a horse, more will follow, claiming specialness, as well.

Take a gander at Tucson's outlying areas to the west on Google Earth sometime. This place looks absolutely terrible, precisely because people don't want to abide by any standards or regulation. It's about quality of life, and it's always a battle.

Basically, you think every individual is special. I think no individual is special.
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Old 08-28-2008, 04:48 AM
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The horse is 32. That's an old horse. It's not like he's a young colt zipping around the paddock and kicking up dust. Dumbarse council should leave the old bloke alone.
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Old 08-28-2008, 08:12 AM
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The horse is 32. That's an old horse. It's not like he's a young colt zipping around the paddock and kicking up dust. Dumbarse council should leave the old bloke alone.
I agree. It's a stupid ordinance anyway. I see nothing wrong with livestock in a town or city. When I owned a large, fenced-in lot in Huntsville, AL I would have loved to have a goat or two but there was this stupid ordinance...
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:39 AM
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Obviously not, and courts tend to agree with me.
Yes, he was there before the town was and, no, the courts do not agree with you that the town was there first: the courts haven't even gotten involved!

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Not a good situation, I agree. I have to deal with that all the time, at work. People that think that they live way out in the sticks fail to acknowledge that the city grows closer and closer...or think that just because they've been there for fifty years grants them some sort of status that grants them the right to be a nuisance. Yes, I deal with this argument every day.
And you like the idea of the city growing closer and closer. You like the idea of these damned suburbanites moving out into the country and then demanding that the country folks change to accommodate them! Why? Because you hate the individual and think that the sole purpose of the individual is to serve the damned collective.

Quote:
What I take exception to is the idea of governance by individual exception. The desires of some lone hick to have a horse in the city simply shouldn't take precidence over the needs of a community to have consistent ordinances, sorry, unless, of course, the community wants to grant that. If you allow one dude to have a horse, more will follow, claiming specialness, as well.
It's not governance by exception, it's the right of the people who were there BEFORE THE TOWN WAS to not have their rights infringed upon. The town had no right to annex the guy's property in the first place.

Quote:
Take a gander at Tucson's outlying areas to the west on Google Earth sometime. This place looks absolutely terrible, precisely because people don't want to abide by any standards or regulation. It's about quality of life, and it's always a battle.
Maybe if those damned suburbanites would stop trying to move out into the country and trying to change the country to suit them, it would look a lot nicer. OR, what looks terrible to you might actually be nice to someone else.

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Basically, you think every individual is special. I think no individual is special.
You're damned right I do!
__________________
A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 08-28-2008, 12:56 PM
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Yes, he was there before the town was and, no, the courts do not agree with you that the town was there first: the courts haven't even gotten involved!
My, such righteous indignation! You don't understand how cities annex and expand their limits, then? Kinda been going on a long time, you know? Time-in-place conferrs no special privileges, sorry. And, I hear this argument every single day, but maybe it's different up in Buffalo....

Quote:
And you like the idea of the city growing closer and closer. You like the idea of these damned suburbanites moving out into the country and then demanding that the country folks change to accommodate them! Why? Because you hate the individual and think that the sole purpose of the individual is to serve the damned collective.
Whether I "like" it or not is immaterial. I get the impression you'd argue with gravity for rights infringement. The bottom line is that this sort of thing happens in every municipality I've ever heard of.

No, I certainly don't "hate" the individual. However, I don't place individuals above and immune to the law, either. This guy is thumbing his nose at everyone else, believing himself to be special or better than everyone else who has to follow the same rules. We don't allow livestock in our city, here, either.

Quote:
It's not governance by exception, it's the right of the people who were there BEFORE THE TOWN WAS to not have their rights infringed upon. The town had no right to annex the guy's property in the first place.
Of course it does. Happens every day. Cities grow. Some like it, some don't. Heck, some even petition the city to annex them, so that they gain infrastructural services like waste disposal and paved road maintenance. Imagine that!

Things change, cities grow and absorb land on the fringe. It's rather unrealistic to demand everything remain static forever.

Quote:
Maybe if those damned suburbanites would stop trying to move out into the country and trying to change the country to suit them, it would look a lot nicer. OR, what looks terrible to you might actually be nice to someone else.
Yes, yes, everyone's damned. And, obviously, I'll need to post some pictures from some of my field inspections. If you believe dozens of burned out cars and piles of building materials is a quality contribution to surrounding property values, then okay..... Here, we tend to frown on that sort of thing, and cite them. Maybe in Buffalo, the "right" to trash one's property is more important than the surrounding community property values?

So......you would deny people the ability to move where they please? That seems a bit inconsistent.

Quote:
You're damned right I do!
Hence our disagreements. I am no anarchist.
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Old 08-28-2008, 04:40 PM
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So......you would deny people the ability to move where they please? That seems a bit inconsistent.
I don't think anyone here is denying peoples' right to move where they please. They are expressing dismay at newbies forcing the original inhabitants to change to accommodate THEM. That is backwards. I'm with Chan on this issue.
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Old 08-28-2008, 05:23 PM
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Too bad the city officials didn't apply a grandfather clause allowing the one horse to remain til death.
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