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Civil Liberties and Civil Rights Discuss Civil Liberties and Civil rights here. Also discuss discrimination against minority groups as well, and ways to solve these issues.

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  #141 (permalink)  
Old 06-21-2008, 09:55 PM
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Vaccinations and baths are not anything alike. One cleans the skin and the other injects a toxin. There is no analogy there.
Incorrect. I explained why. Both are preventative measures. They prevent you from getting sick. One cleans you to do it, one immunizes you to do it. YOu fear vaccines, irrationally, and want to prevent your kids from getting them, which can get them and others sick. Someone can fear bathing irrationally and not do it, thus getting sick and perhaps transmitting those germs to others. In both cases, it can get you very sick. They are only dissimilar on the surface, but not in the way I am comparing them. An analogy needn't use two identical objects.

Vaccines are safe, reasonably, and so is bathing. Both MIGHT hurt you...although it's incredibly rare and the positives outweigh the negatives.


According to me, yes, it is abuse. And my opinion's correct, just as it would be correct if I said refusing to bathe your children because of unfounded fears of it is a form of negligent abuse. You can't have your cake and eat it too. What is abuse is not merely my opinion. Reason dictates it. If you can make your kid sick (or kill him), or endanger him as such, by not vaccinating, why can't you also kill and endanger him so seriously other ways? Why this peculiar double think? I mean, it should therefore be legal in all similar ways if you are consistent.
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Last edited by Technocratic_Utilitarian : 06-21-2008 at 10:07 PM.
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  #142 (permalink)  
Old 06-21-2008, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Oregon Elephant View Post
Yes, but Placebo's have documented success, in some areas greater than western medicene. I have a book at home that I'll go through (you might have read it, Voodoo Science), that talks about Acupuncture (or however it is spelled), I could give the jist of it now, but I want to double check the book and it's sources.

Right - which proves that the mind is able to do an incredible job of healing the body!
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  #143 (permalink)  
Old 06-21-2008, 10:00 PM
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Placebos only have limited effect. They can't cure actual diseases. You won't cure aids with happy thoughts and thinking the medicine will.
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  #144 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2008, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by xjoe3x View Post
There is a chance for many bad side effects from vaccination.
WHC - VACCINATION: RISKS AND ALTERNATIVES
It should be their choice if they want to take that risk.

The parents should make the choice.
There was a time in the not-too-distant past when parents would intentionally expose their young children to other children that had measles or mumps so that they would get it over with and not have to deal with either of these as adults.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #145 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2008, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by AnnEsthesia View Post
Let me pose a question.

If a child decides that it does not want to eat anymore and the family, because of faith, decides that God will provide and does nothing about it and the kid starves to death... would you be claiming that this was not a case of neglect?
No, this is not a case of neglect. It would be a case of neglect if the child wanted to eat but the parents wouldn't let him.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #146 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2008, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Jojo View Post
Okay - what about the case of a father, a few years back, who poured gasoline on his young son and set him on fire - a custodial issue. dad objected to sharing custody. The kid lived, with crippling burns. Does society have a say in that?
"Society" doesn't but the local government does simply because it is an act of assault.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #147 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2008, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
There was a time in the not-too-distant past when parents would intentionally expose their young children to other children that had measles or mumps so that they would get it over with and not have to deal with either of these as adults.
Some of my friends got chicken pox this way.
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  #148 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2008, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
No, this is not a case of neglect. It would be a case of neglect if the child wanted to eat but the parents wouldn't let him.
Really? So if your 10 year old is anorexic and you don't bother to get her treatment and she dies, that is not neglect?
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  #149 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2008, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Donkey Jote View Post
Some of my friends got chicken pox this way.
Yes, and they survived it, did they not?
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #150 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2008, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by AnnEsthesia View Post
Really? So if your 10 year old is anorexic and you don't bother to get her treatment and she dies, that is not neglect?
No, it isn't neglect. If the 10 year-old gets hungry enough she'll eat eventually.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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