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Civil Liberties and Civil Rights Discuss Civil Liberties and Civil rights here. Also discuss discrimination against minority groups as well, and ways to solve these issues.

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  #111 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Skerlnik View Post
It horrifies me that you see this as a righteous, punitive issue. All her fault, of course...especially if she has the temerity to actually enjoy sex! Omigod, what next?
It's her body. She has the right to say no. However, if she chooses to say yes then she should bear the consequences of her choice (but she should also get as much child support out of the father that she can).

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I can't figure you out, Chan. Wouldn't you be for the choice and freedom that contraceptives provide, or are you saying that all sex should result in pregnancy,by God?
But I'm also for the freedom of businesses to decide what products they will or will not sell.

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Anyway, take a stroll through a WalMart sometime, and you might agree with me that procreation should absolutely be preventable.
Well, the founder of Planned Parenthood proposed a solution and it had nothing to do with contraceptives. But that solution is unthinkable in a civilized society.
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  #112 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumara View Post
Just like Viagra.
Yes, Viagra is also a want and not a need. I'd like to see it made illegal for prision medical facilities to issue it to prisoners and I would like to see it made illegal for Medicaid/Medicare to cover it.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #113 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
Yes, I'm reading the thread. But your opinion does not constitute fact. If a religious hospital won't give an abortafacient then the woman should go to a secular hospital. Also, doctors don't need to wait until the hospital pharmacy opens up to get drugs for their patients (to administer in the emergency room). Third, not all pharmacies that are not in hospitals are open 24/7 either.
It is a fact that women have gone to the hospital, been given a prescription and, accompanied by a rape counselor, been denied having their prescription filled. It is a fact that hospitals have refused to give women the medications and procedures that they have requested and have also refused to refer them to someone who will. It is a fact that some pharmacists have taken prescriptions, refused to fill them and refused to give them back. Those are facts.
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  #114 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
First of all, women (and men) don't need contraceptives to have a healthy, enjoyable sex life. Second, condoms are also contraception.
They do if they do not wish to become pregnant constantly. Condoms are much less effective and are prone to breakage... and perhaps you missed it, but these "moral police" are also refusing to sell condoms.
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  #115 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
It's her body. She has the right to say no. However, if she chooses to say yes then she should bear the consequences of her choice (but she should also get as much child support out of the father that she can).

But I'm also for the freedom of businesses to decide what products they will or will not sell.

Well, the founder of Planned Parenthood proposed a solution and it had nothing to do with contraceptives. But that solution is unthinkable in a civilized society.
It is her right to say no to sex, but not her right to have contraception?

And nice trying to skew the discussion away from the topic.
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  #116 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:30 PM
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It is a fact that women have gone to the hospital, been given a prescription and, accompanied by a rape counselor, been denied having their prescription filled.
And private businesses are free to refuse to sell any product. What part of that do you not understand. These women can go to another pharmacy.

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It is a fact that hospitals have refused to give women the medications and procedures that they have requested and have also refused to refer them to someone who will.
So, these women should look elsewhere.

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It is a fact that some pharmacists have taken prescriptions, refused to fill them and refused to give them back. Those are facts.
Except for refusing to return the paper on which the prescription is written to the patient, I don't have a problem with pharmacists making such choices. These women can take their business elsewhere and encourage others to take their business elsewhere.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #117 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by AnnEsthesia View Post
It is her right to say no to sex, but not her right to have contraception?
Contraception is a commodity, not a right.
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #118 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
And private businesses are free to refuse to sell any product. What part of that do you not understand. These women can go to another pharmacy.

So, these women should look elsewhere.

Except for refusing to return the paper on which the prescription is written to the patient, I don't have a problem with pharmacists making such choices. These women can take their business elsewhere and encourage others to take their business elsewhere.
Change contraceptive and women to men and heart medications. Would you still agree?

Medications are not the same as any other product. If you are making it restrictive and hard for a woman to get their legal prescription filled, then you need to go find something else to sell.
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  #119 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by AnnEsthesia View Post
They do if they do not wish to become pregnant constantly. Condoms are much less effective and are prone to breakage... and perhaps you missed it, but these "moral police" are also refusing to sell condoms.
And it's their right to choose not to sell certain products. It's your right to take your business elsewhere and to encourage others to take their business elsewhere. Let the marketplace work!
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A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

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  #120 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Chan View Post
Contraception is a commodity, not a right.
No, it is a right. Or do you feel only men should be able to have healthy and happy sex lives?
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