People can be very successful without going to school. They can learn a trade(mechanic, carpenter, ect.). They can be successfully self-taught or home schooled.

People are stupid already. I have always thought people were stupid. I see no change except more freedom to the people. Also if the parents do not have the child educated and that person works as a janitor there entire life that is perfectly acceptable.

If/when I have a kid I will have more than enough money to afford it and any possible unforeseen circumstances. He/she will attend private school, most certainly not public school. But hey if a parent wants to train a child to take over the family business and not go to school that is fine by me.

That isn't the point, and you know it.
I also don't think it's fine for kids to be able to work instead of going to school, or for them to take up a trade instead of going to high school.

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"Moreover, I am cognizant of the interrelatedness of all communities and states...Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality, tied in a single garment of destiny. Whatever affects one directly, affects all indirectly. Never again can we afford to live with the narrow, provincial "outside agitator" idea. Anyone who lives inside the United States can never be considered an outsider anywhere within its bounds."



~Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

It is silly to have them "take on the family business" instead of going to school, given these people will grow up and require basic skills. They require ethical, civic training because they are going to be voters and make policy. If you can't pass, much less attend formal school, you simply shouldn't be able to vote. Period.

It is not silly. Any citizen of America should have the ability to vote. What basic skills do they need? If they can be successful in business without going to school than you are forcefully wasting there time. I do not condone "ethical behavior" being taught by the state anyway.

Why not? Trades pull quite a bit of money. You do not like it so you think you should force everyone to do what you think is best.

So, what you worship (people) is something that is stupid and doesn't know what's good for itself? Doesn't this directly contradict your earlier statement that you know what's best for you? Or are you saying that you're not human?

Oh, and you - a mere child - know what's really good for kids?

Since the government is made up of people, and people are stupid (according to you), and since the act of educating children is conducted by people, aren't you perpetuating stupidity by having the stupid educate the stupid?

But we're not talking about giving children the choice. We're talking about whether or not education is a responsibility that should be left to the parents (since it is an inherent part of being a parent) or whether you government-loving nanny-staters should take that responsibility away from the parents and give it to the government and then force parents to comply.

Yes, it is their choice - and they can suffer the consequences.

__________________
A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

Isn't that the fundemental principal of fascism?

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Set your destination with your heart, get there with your mind.

"The wisest men follow their own direction." - Euripides

Chan, how about this: It is the parents' responsibility to get their kid educated in the same way it's their responsibility to feed and clothe them. However, nobody expects the parents to grow their kid's food, or to weave clothes. The State is merely a provider for this education.

The public education system is (supposed to be) provided for the benefit of all, as a "public good". Now, certainly, we'd agree that the state has been rather sub-par, but that's not really the point, here.

My focus is on equality and access. If private schools can provide no-cost, standardized, quality education to every child, then I have no problems with it, as it would then be essentially indistinguishable from what the public system is supposed to be.

And the ideas I have heard about a "voucher" system, simply publify the private schools, paying the schools from taxpayer money in just a roundabout way, so what's the point? If the parents get vouchers from the government worth X amount to send Timmy where they want, that pretty much eliminates this whole competition concept, unless schools get the right to refuse service, so to speak. I have a serious problem with that.

Anyway, the OP question was "should education be mandatory and state run?"

Mandatory? Yes, I think so. Pretty much always has been, and I question the sense of any parent who felt NOT educating kids was the way to go. What else is an eight year old going to do, get a job? If anyone seriously thinks that not educating kids is best, I am just going to back away very slowly...

Now, the "state-run" question. I'd say "probably". It's not the only alternative, but it's the only in-place entity I can think of with the resources, consistency and permanency to do it. Public schools are run by local school boards anyway, meaning US, so if your local schools suck, then get on the board and help fix it!

We have a lot of retirees here, who whine about having to pay property taxes that fund schools when their own kids are out of it. Yet, they also whine that our schools here are underperforming, and are upset that schools have to close, and there's 40 students per teacher. Hmmmm.

Demanding top-notch services from the government, yet griping, resenting and finding ways not to actually have to pay to make that happen: America's pasttime.

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An employee gets trampled to death by a frenzied, greedy mob at a Walmart sale, and customers actually complained when the store closed. Yet, I'm the bad guy for suggesting policies that assume people act like retarded herd animals that need government nannying and control....

But they should have the choice of growing the food or making the clothes if they want to do so. Likewise, they should have the option of deciding what education to provide for their children or the external sources for this education.

You know damned well that it isn't for the public good but, instead, for the good of the government. Maybe you should read John Taylor Gatto's material sometime.

See, there you go again with the wrong-headed assumptions. You assume that there must be equality and you assume that education must come at no cost to the parents. Even the present system costs parents money (the ones that pay property taxes) and as long as there are differences in children there will never be equal education because some children learn more than others.

Again, I'm not talking about a voucher system and I would oppose a voucher system because it's just another wealth redistribution scheme.


No on the first part and absolutely not on the second part.

And just who the hell do you think you are to dictate to parents how they must raise their children? If you want to subject your children to these damned government indoctrination centers, feel free to do so but don't you ever presume to dictate that other parents must do likewise.

You really do need to read John Taylor Gatto's work.

They have every right to complain. Why should people who don't have children in the school system pay to support that school system? Also, keep in mind that more and more money keeps getting thrown at schools and they are not getting any better.

Government and top-notch is an oxymoron.

__________________
A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

There is also a problem about "competition" that is also hitting the public schools. There is already some competition. Parents tend to locate where they believe they will get the best education. White Middle Class Soccer Moms look for the "best" school by doing internet research. They find one, then they move there en mass. What happens? The school has a large influx of people and the quality goes down. They need to raise taxes (the rates) to fund the new influx, and this ends up placing people out of the system except those who can afford it).

The solution is that they just reject or do not accept students (but they can't). A private school can. They cherry-pick to keep their relatively small, homogeneous populations of good students.