Welcome to Political Fever - The Political Debate Forums.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest with limited access. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. You can also take part in our Private Debates where you can test your skills against an opponent. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us. After you Register the advertisements will disappear on the site!

Go Back   Political Fever - The Political Debate Forums > Political Central > American Politics

American Politics This is the main forum of political fever. This forum can be used for anything political, from the 08 election to the war in Iraq!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #91 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2008, 08:51 AM
Congressman
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Userid: 745
Posts: 2,585
Rep Power: 3
Truth for a Change is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
You both have it wrong:

"...and provide for the common Defense and general Welfare of the United States...."

The "general Welfare" is for the States, not medical insurance and food stamps for citizens.
US Constitution.. preamble:

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquillity, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."


According to the Constitution, the states should be free to do what they wish becuause the Constitution (as written without the 14th amendment and Supreme Court rulings) does not apply to the States.
Reply With Quote
  #92 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2008, 09:46 AM
Chan's Avatar
Congressman
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Userid: 133
Location: Buffalo, New York, USA
Posts: 5,775
Rep Power: 8
Chan has a spectacular aura aboutChan has a spectacular aura about
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
You both have it wrong:

"...and provide for the common Defense and general Welfare of the United States...."

The "general Welfare" is for the States, not medical insurance and food stamps for citizens.
Yes, the general welfare of that geopolitical entity we call the United States of America. It does not mean the general welfare of the citizens and does not refer to social programs (over which the federal government has no constitutional authority whatsoever).
__________________
A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

Reply With Quote
  #93 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2008, 10:21 AM
Chan's Avatar
Congressman
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Userid: 133
Location: Buffalo, New York, USA
Posts: 5,775
Rep Power: 8
Chan has a spectacular aura aboutChan has a spectacular aura about
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth for a Change View Post
US Constitution.. preamble:

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquillity, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."


According to the Constitution, the states should be free to do what they wish becuause the Constitution (as written without the 14th amendment and Supreme Court rulings) does not apply to the States.
Well, let's see how that was viewed back in the late 18th and early 19th centuries:

"Another not unimportant consideration is, that the powers of the *general government will be, and indeed must be, principally employed upon external objects, such as war, peace, negotiations with foreign powers, and foreign commerce. In its internal operations it can touch but few objects, except to introduce regulations beneficial to the commerce, intercourse, and other relations, between the states, and to lay taxes for the common good. The powers of the states, on the other hand, extend to all objects, which, in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, and liberties, and property of the people, and the internal order, improvement, and prosperity of the state." Joseph Story, Commentaries on the Constitution, 1833

* federal

Then there's Federalist Paper 46 by James Madison.

Finally, notice this from Federalist Paper 45 by James Madison:

"The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce; with which last the power of taxation will, for the most part, be connected. The powers reserved to the several States will extend to all the objects which, in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, liberties, and properties of the people, and the internal order, improvement, and prosperity of the State."
__________________
A panda walks into a cafe. He orders a sandwich, eats it, then draws a gun and fires two shots in the air.

"Why?" asks the confused waiter, as the panda makes toward the exit. The panda produces a badly punctuated wildlife manual and tosses it over his shoulder.

"I'm a panda," he says at the door. "Look it up."

The waiter turns to the relevant entry and, sure enough, finds an explanation.

"Panda. Large black-and-white bear-like mammal, native to China. Eats, shoots and leaves."

Reply With Quote
  #94 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2008, 06:59 PM
Affrayer's Avatar
Congressman
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Userid: 343
Posts: 4,078
Rep Power: 5
Affrayer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth for a Change View Post
No.. the Constitution's words are

Provide for the Defense...

Promote the General welfare...

Promote is NOT the same as provide for.
Hahahahahahahahaha...every time some yahoo starts babbling about the Constitution it's almost a guarantee they haven't read it. Here's what the Constitution says:

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States;

Can you please read the constitution first before you start telling everyone else to read it?
__________________
I'm Proud I never Voted For Bush!



PAT PAULSEN FOR PRESIDENT
Reply With Quote
  #95 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2008, 07:01 PM
Affrayer's Avatar
Congressman
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Userid: 343
Posts: 4,078
Rep Power: 5
Affrayer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
The "general Welfare" is for the States, not medical insurance and food stamps for citizens.
Nope, it specifically says "United States." It doesn't say "States." It doesn't say "Several States." It doesn't say "each State." Instead it refers to the "United States."

I have a book for you. It's called "See Spot Run."
__________________
I'm Proud I never Voted For Bush!



PAT PAULSEN FOR PRESIDENT
Reply With Quote
  #96 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2008, 07:31 PM
KSigMason's Avatar
Master Mason
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Userid: 765
Location: Boise, ID
Age: 24
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 0
KSigMason is on a distinguished road
Default

I may be wrong, but I thought Embassy workers were supposed to be neutral and the DoS regulations forbid political attendance anyway. Other stories say it was Bush while others say it was an Undersecretary so I'm suspicious about the story.
__________________
Be thou faithful unto Death
And I will give thee a crown of Life
Reply With Quote
  #97 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2008, 08:04 PM
Affrayer's Avatar
Congressman
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Userid: 343
Posts: 4,078
Rep Power: 5
Affrayer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KSigMason View Post
I may be wrong, but I thought Embassy workers were supposed to be neutral and the DoS regulations forbid political attendance anyway. Other stories say it was Bush while others say it was an Undersecretary so I'm suspicious about the story.
There's more...McCain has been a regular travelier to Iraq. What did he do while he was there? Did he take cameras or campaign staff into the hospitals? Did he even visit wounded soldiers?

Not one word in the media about what McCain't has done...
__________________
I'm Proud I never Voted For Bush!



PAT PAULSEN FOR PRESIDENT
Reply With Quote
  #98 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2008, 08:02 AM
Congressman
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Userid: 745
Posts: 2,585
Rep Power: 3
Truth for a Change is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Affrayer View Post
Hahahahahahahahaha...every time some yahoo starts babbling about the Constitution it's almost a guarantee they haven't read it. Here's what the Constitution says:

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts [u]and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States.

Can you please read the constitution first before you start telling everyone else to read it?
Read it again, you missed a few words....

[Preamble ]
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquillity, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.


FindLaw: U.S. Constitution: Articles
Reply With Quote
  #99 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2008, 08:21 AM
Affrayer's Avatar
Congressman
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Userid: 343
Posts: 4,078
Rep Power: 5
Affrayer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth for a Change View Post
[Preamble ]
Preamble? The preamble is not law!

Neophyte...
__________________
I'm Proud I never Voted For Bush!



PAT PAULSEN FOR PRESIDENT
Reply With Quote
  #100 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2008, 08:24 AM
Congressman
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Userid: 745
Posts: 2,585
Rep Power: 3
Truth for a Change is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Affrayer View Post
Preamble? The preamble is not law!

Neophyte...
so, you are saying that the preamble to the Constitution is not part of the Constitution?

LOL..
Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On






     Top Political Sites  
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:34 PM.
Political Fever 2007/2008
   Word Search   |   Family Friendly   |   AdSense Forum   |   Game Cheats   |   Coupon Codes   |   Spore Game   |   Xcode Forum   |   Political Forums   |   Internet Marketing   |   Social Networking    |   Sudoku   |   Mobile Marketing   |   Web Forms   |   Articles & News   |   Loans & Credit Repair   |   Online Coupon Codes   |   Loans   |   Sudoku Puzzles   |   Map Games   |   Spore Screenshots   |   Acai Berry